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<head><meta charset="utf-8"><title>Meeting-2019-03-14 · t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines · Zulip Chat Archive</title></head>
<h2>Stream: <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/index.html">t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines</a></h2>
<h3>Topic: <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html">Meeting-2019-03-14</a></h3>

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<a name="160790237"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790237" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790237">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>Happy Thursday!</p>



<a name="160790262"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790262" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Alan Jeffrey <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790262">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:16)</a>:</h4>
<p><span aria-label="wave" class="emoji emoji-1f44b" role="img" title="wave">:wave:</span></p>



<a name="160790264"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790264" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Nicole Mazzuca <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790264">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:16)</a>:</h4>
<p>(* waves *)</p>



<a name="160790315"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790315" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790315">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>cc <span class="user-group-mention" data-user-group-id="810">@WG-unsafe-code-guidelines</span></p>



<a name="160790322"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790322" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790322">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>hi</p>



<a name="160790324"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790324" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790324">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>Everyone ready for a meeting?</p>



<a name="160790335"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790335" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790335">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:17)</a>:</h4>
<p>in one hour or now ?</p>



<a name="160790428"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790428" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790428">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:18)</a>:</h4>
<p>(In calendar, the meeting is pegged to US time, so now.)</p>



<a name="160790449"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790449" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790449">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:18)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="132920">@gnzlbg</span> in portland</p>



<a name="160790491"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790491" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790491">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:19)</a>:</h4>
<p>so i'm ready I think I was notified that the meeting changed time but didn't register it mentally :D</p>



<a name="160790625"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160790625" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160790625">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:20)</a>:</h4>
<p><strong>Reminder:</strong> I just wanted to mention the <a href="https://internals.rust-lang.org/t/lang-team-working-group-sync-meetings/9573/2?u=nikomatsakis" target="_blank" title="https://internals.rust-lang.org/t/lang-team-working-group-sync-meetings/9573/2?u=nikomatsakis">lang team sync meeting</a> which takes place in 3.5 hours. <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/lang-team/blob/master/working-groups/unsafe-code-guidelines/notes/2019-03-14.md" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/lang-team/blob/master/working-groups/unsafe-code-guidelines/notes/2019-03-14.md">The write-up of current status is here</a>, if you have any comments, changes, or additions they would be welcome (or thoughts on specific questions you'd like to add).</p>



<a name="160791004"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791004" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791004">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>Ok so, how is validity going?</p>



<a name="160791070"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791070" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791070">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>have we had enough discussions to do some writeups</p>



<a name="160791097"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791097" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791097">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>From the meeting notes:</p>
<ul>
<li>For the "boring stuff" (enums, structs, arrays), there is relatively<br>
  little controversy.  These invariants are largely created by<br>
  combinined other invariants, and gnzlbg plans to do a write-up on<br>
  these topics soon.</li>
<li>For integers, references, and unions, there are a wide variety of<br>
  opinions on the table:<ul>
<li>On the one hand, stronger invariants enable more layout optimizations,<br>
  as well as affecting things like [exhaustive matching][np].</li>
<li>On the other, we want to enable common unsafe code patterns.</li>
<li>Finally, we want to ensure that we have a feasible implementation<br>
  in miri that can do dynamic checking and detect UB.</li>
</ul>
</li>
</ul>
<p>[np]: <a href="http://smallcultfollowing.com/babysteps/blog/2018/08/13/never-patterns-exhaustive-matching-and-uninhabited-types-oh-my/" target="_blank" title="http://smallcultfollowing.com/babysteps/blog/2018/08/13/never-patterns-exhaustive-matching-and-uninhabited-types-oh-my/">http://smallcultfollowing.com/babysteps/blog/2018/08/13/never-patterns-exhaustive-matching-and-uninhabited-types-oh-my/</a></p>



<a name="160791112"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791112" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791112">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:24)</a>:</h4>
<p>but that's all I know ;)</p>



<a name="160791146"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791146" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791146">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:25)</a>:</h4>
<p>we had talked about trying to do some sort of summary</p>



<a name="160791152"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791152" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791152">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:25)</a>:</h4>
<p>to help "collect" the discussions on ints/references</p>



<a name="160791190"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791190" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791190">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:26)</a>:</h4>
<p><a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/lang-team/blob/master/working-groups/unsafe-code-guidelines/notes/2019-03-14.md#places-we-could-use-help" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/lang-team/blob/master/working-groups/unsafe-code-guidelines/notes/2019-03-14.md#places-we-could-use-help">as described here</a></p>



<a name="160791234"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791234" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791234">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:26)</a>:</h4>
<p>but we don't really have a plan for who will do that afaik</p>



<a name="160791333"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791333" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791333">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>hmm...i want to volunteer but i've been pretty swamped. i could create a db paper and share the link so that if i start and then get swamped, it doesn't get lost?</p>



<a name="160791375"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791375" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791375">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:27)</a>:</h4>
<p>one point about validity that i always mention is teachability, how easy / hard will it be to explain to somebody what must always hold, validity wise.</p>



<a name="160791490"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791490" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791490">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:28)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok...so it does seem like we're ready to do writeups for validity</p>



<a name="160791493"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791493" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791493">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:28)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>hmm...i want to volunteer but i've been pretty swamped. i could create a db paper and share the link so that if i start and then get swamped, it doesn't get lost?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>seems like a good start =)</p>



<a name="160791495"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791495" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791495">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>which is good to hear</p>



<a name="160791520"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791520" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791520">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>one point about validity that i always mention is teachability, how easy / hard will it be to explain to somebody what must always hold, validity wise.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>one question I have</p>



<a name="160791531"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791531" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791531">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>hi all! sorry, I missed that mtg is 1h earlier today</p>



<a name="160791540"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791540" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791540">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span>'s original wrote-up talked some about what it means for something to "always" hold</p>



<a name="160791547"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791547" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791547">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>have we discussed that very much?</p>



<a name="160791589"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791589" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791589">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:29)</a>:</h4>
<p>i don't think we have</p>



<a name="160791662"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791662" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791662">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>do we mean that for any execution of a program it will hold?</p>



<a name="160791666"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791666" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791666">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>(is there controversy?)</p>



<a name="160791674"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791674" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791674">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>i think we kind of just accepted it, as in, if some invariant does not always need to hold, then it is not a validity invariant</p>



<a name="160791727"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791727" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791727">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>I find it kind of unclear in my head, somehow. but I guess it means, roughly, "on every access"</p>



<a name="160791732"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791732" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791732">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:30)</a>:</h4>
<p>wdym "any execution"?</p>



<a name="160791798"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791798" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791798">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>i understood that they must hold even if there is no access</p>



<a name="160791818"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791818" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791818">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>if the program is non-deterministic, validity is like OOB or other kinds of UB... if there is a a way to make it happen, then it happens</p>



<a name="160791832"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791832" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791832">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>i understood that they hold even if there is no access</p>
</blockquote>
<p>the problem is defining what that means</p>



<a name="160791834"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791834" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791834">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:31)</a>:</h4>
<p>memory is not typed</p>



<a name="160791903"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791903" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791903">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>so only at an access do we have a type and a location and can verify that the memory at that location matches the type</p>



<a name="160791909"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791909" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791909">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>let b: bool = transmute(3); // === unreachable</p>



<a name="160791910"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791910" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791910">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>we have an issue about that...</p>



<a name="160791930"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791930" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791930">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>here: <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84">https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84</a></p>



<a name="160791962"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791962" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791962">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="132920">@gnzlbg</span> there is a bad access there: when the 3 gets written to <code>b</code> as type <code>bool</code></p>



<a name="160791969"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160791969" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160791969">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:32)</a>:</h4>
<p>so that one is UB even with an "only at accesses" model</p>



<a name="160792008"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792008" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792008">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>so are there different models of 'always'?</p>



<a name="160792010"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792010" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792010">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>(<code>=</code> is a typed operation, and it acts at type <code>bool</code> here)</p>



<a name="160792020"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792020" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792020">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="126854">@avadacatavra</span> well look at <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84">https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84</a></p>



<a name="160792026"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792026" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792026">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>I guess a "tricky" case might be if you had a <code>*mut T</code> pointing at some memory and you modified it (via some alias) to not be a  valid T, but you never use the reference again, right?</p>



<a name="160792054"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792054" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792054">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>there are examples there of things that are not UB according to Miri or any model I have designed or seen so far</p>



<a name="160792057"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792057" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792057">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>anyway, I'll read ucg#84</p>



<a name="160792065"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792065" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792065">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:33)</a>:</h4>
<p>but would be UB under some informal idea of "always"</p>



<a name="160792137"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792137" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792137">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>I guess a "tricky" case might be if you had a <code>*mut T</code> pointing at some memory and you modified it (via some alias) to not be a  valid T, but you never use the reference again, right?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>yeah that's exactly what the issue is about</p>



<a name="160792144"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792144" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792144">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>ah I remember <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/84" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/84">#84</a></p>



<a name="160792148"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792148" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792148">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>/me feels an existential crisis coming on</p>



<a name="160792159"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792159" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792159">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>why that?^^</p>



<a name="160792163"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792163" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792163">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:34)</a>:</h4>
<p>ps <a href="https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84" target="_blank" title="https://github.com/rust-lang/unsafe-code-guidelines/issues/84">ucg#84</a> should work now as a shorthand</p>



<a name="160792222"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792222" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792222">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>so this is tricky</p>



<a name="160792239"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792239" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792239">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>anyway we don't have to work out the details, I mostly wanted to ensure this question was not overlooked:)</p>



<a name="160792254"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792254" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792254">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:35)</a>:</h4>
<p>(though we can also discuss, if there aren't other things)</p>



<a name="160792345"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792345" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792345">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>i would say the other thing would be (since we seem to be ready for writeups) WHAT'S NEXT</p>



<a name="160792370"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792370" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792370">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>PRs ?</p>



<a name="160792380"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792380" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792380">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:36)</a>:</h4>
<p>also this reminds me I still have to set up a sandbox for Zoom... or is there an opensource client?</p>



<a name="160792431"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792431" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792431">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> and <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="125253">@Nicole Mazzuca</span> wanted to read the layout of array and we wanted to merge it afterwards if there weren't any issues</p>



<a name="160792434"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792434" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792434">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>i would say the other thing would be (since we seem to be ready for writeups) WHAT'S NEXT</p>
</blockquote>
<p>you mean after validity?</p>



<a name="160792453"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792453" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792453">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah</p>



<a name="160792465"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792465" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792465">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>there's a lot of writeup still needing to be done, not sure if I am ready to look that far ahead^^</p>



<a name="160792471"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792471" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> Nicole Mazzuca <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792471">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:37)</a>:</h4>
<p>ah, sorry, I did that and it read well</p>



<a name="160792528"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792528" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792528">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> to be clear i'm not saying we're moving on yet, but we should start thinking about what the next topic should be</p>



<a name="160792567"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792567" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792567">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>also--who will be at rustconf?</p>



<a name="160792609"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792609" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792609">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="126854">@avadacatavra</span> once validity and layout are ironed out, we should probably have a sprint to polish the book, ideally in such a form that can be RFC'ed</p>



<a name="160792625"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792625" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792625">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>but I don't think we are there yet</p>



<a name="160792632"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792632" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792632">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:38)</a>:</h4>
<p>yeah</p>



<a name="160792646"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792646" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792646">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>/me checks when RustConf is</p>



<a name="160792730"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792730" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792730">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:39)</a>:</h4>
<p>One thing that comes to mind is that</p>



<a name="160792750"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792750" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792750">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>there may be value in pursuing stacked borrows more, not 100% sure what that means</p>



<a name="160792804"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792804" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792804">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>so, i won't be at rustconf (my best friend is getting married). but if there's enough interest, i'll facilitate some wg face to face meetings</p>



<a name="160792820"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792820" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792820">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>uh, RustConf overlaps witrh ICFP</p>



<a name="160792821"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792821" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792821">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>e.g., I was thinking about the controversy around NLL and two-phase borrows, which relates to stacked borrows</p>



<a name="160792828"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792828" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792828">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>and with ICFP being in Berlin, I should really go there</p>



<a name="160792836"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792836" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792836">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:40)</a>:</h4>
<p>so I won't be at RustConf, I'm afraid</p>



<a name="160792910"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792910" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792910">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:41)</a>:</h4>
<p>does it make sense to tackle stacked borrows when we dont even have a memory model or a MIR model?</p>



<a name="160792919"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792919" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792919">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:41)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> pursuing stacked borrows more before the first RFC?</p>



<a name="160792999"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160792999" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160792999">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>also we have a couple open questions in the ucg repo</p>



<a name="160793012"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793012" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793012">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:42)</a>:</h4>
<p>and some more in the old repo (that we should migrate)</p>



<a name="160793267"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793267" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793267">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>i think it definetely makes sense to continue to pursue stacked borrows in miri, but I recall I had some questions about it that weren't easy to answer without a MIR model</p>



<a name="160793283"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793283" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793283">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p><span class="user-mention silent" data-user-id="116009">nikomatsakis</span> pursuing stacked borrows more before the first RFC?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>not as a blocker for first RFC</p>



<a name="160793295"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793295" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793295">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>more as a "next area to focus on" <em>after</em> RFC</p>



<a name="160793305"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793305" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793305">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:44)</a>:</h4>
<p>I'm not sure if that is the right thing though</p>



<a name="160793471"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793471" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793471">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>re: ref/int; if we can disentangle them then maybe doing it the usual GH style is not actually so bad. but it might anyway be worth experimenting with dropbox paper</p>



<a name="160793477"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793477" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793477">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>I think that's the long term goal, so it makes sense to work out the steps required to get there</p>



<a name="160793496"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793496" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793496">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>like, if <span class="user-mention" data-user-id="132920">@gnzlbg</span> did the struct/enum stuff there, that'd make it much easier for me to to drive-by fixes</p>



<a name="160793506"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793506" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793506">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:46)</a>:</h4>
<p>and paper has a "comment" thing, right?</p>



<a name="160793561"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793561" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793561">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>we should just try not to have technical discussions there</p>



<a name="160793570"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793570" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793570">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>they should be moved back to the existing or a new GH issue</p>



<a name="160793588"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793588" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793588">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>ok, so:<br>
- meeting with lang team later today<br>
- gnzlbg doing some writeups (enum, struct, array)<br>
- i'll start the other one (int, refs, etc) and share a link<br>
- stacked borrows next?<br>
- work on RFC (what will this cover--draft in paper?)</p>



<a name="160793591"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793591" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793591">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:47)</a>:</h4>
<p>and we often end up discussing technical stuff in the GH PR... hm</p>



<a name="160793812"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793812" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793812">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:49)</a>:</h4>
<p>that feels unavoidable, when there is a prototype of the spec new issues always show up</p>



<a name="160793868"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793868" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793868">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:49)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>i'll start the other one (int, refs, etc) and share a link</p>
</blockquote>
<p>cool! I figured I'd have to do that.^^</p>



<a name="160793945"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160793945" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160793945">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:50)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>that feels unavoidable, when there is a prototype of the spec new issues always show up</p>
</blockquote>
<p>yeah. and paper isn't very good for that.</p>



<a name="160794006"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794006" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794006">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:50)</a>:</h4>
<p>so anything else ?</p>



<a name="160794028"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794028" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794028">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>/me needs more tea now</p>



<a name="160794036"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794036" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794036">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>I just checked and travis-ci is disabled for the repo in the rust-lang/ org</p>



<a name="160794051"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794051" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794051">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>I can fix that, probably</p>



<a name="160794061"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794061" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794061">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>and paper has a "comment" thing, right?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I'm a big fan of paper's comment thing</p>



<a name="160794066"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794066" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794066">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>we should just try not to have technical discussions there</p>
</blockquote>
<p>but yes this</p>



<a name="160794090"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794090" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> avadacatavra <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794090">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:51)</a>:</h4>
<p>i do all of my blog post drafting in paper now</p>



<a name="160794325"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794325" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794325">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:54)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>I just checked and travis-ci is disabled for the repo in the rust-lang/ org</p>
</blockquote>
<p>fixed</p>



<a name="160794370"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794370" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794370">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>thanks</p>



<a name="160794379"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794379" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794379">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>although I probably have to edit the travis config</p>



<a name="160794388"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794388" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794388">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>to add back the encrypted token thing</p>



<a name="160794402"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794402" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794402">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:54)</a>:</h4>
<p>yes :/</p>



<a name="160794500"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794500" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794500">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:55)</a>:</h4>
<p>i'd like to propose something for the next meeting: triaging all still open repr-issues. It seems to me that some of them are already fixed, some need fixing before an RFC, and some would require RFCs of their own.</p>



<a name="160794756"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794756" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794756">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:57)</a>:</h4>
<p>I dont understand the distinction between the last two</p>



<a name="160794824"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794824" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> nikomatsakis <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794824">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:58)</a>:</h4>
<blockquote>
<p>i'd like to propose something for the next meeting: triaging all still open repr-issues. It seems to me that some of them are already fixed, some need fixing before an RFC, and some would require RFCs of their own.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I like the idea of going over them, regardless.</p>



<a name="160794870"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794870" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794870">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:59)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="120791">@RalfJ</span> for example we might want to guarantee further enum optimizations, but those don't need to be part of the first UCG RFC</p>



<a name="160794926"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160794926" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160794926">(Mar 14 2019 at 15:59)</a>:</h4>
<p>as in the first UCG RFC documents what we already guarantee, but proposing new guaranteed enum layout optimizations might be better done on its own RFC</p>



<a name="160795195"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160795195" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> RalfJ <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160795195">(Mar 14 2019 at 16:01)</a>:</h4>
<p>I see. so those would be issue we'd leave open for now, not blocking The RFC.</p>



<a name="160795284"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160795284" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160795284">(Mar 14 2019 at 16:02)</a>:</h4>
<p>yes</p>



<a name="160797007"></a>
<h4><a href="https://rust-lang.zulipchat.com#narrow/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14/near/160797007" class="zl"><img src="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/assets/img/zulip.svg" alt="view this post on Zulip" style="width:20px;height:20px;"></a> gnzlbg <a href="https://rust-lang.github.io/zulip_archive/stream/136281-t-lang/wg-unsafe-code-guidelines/topic/Meeting-2019-03-14.html#160797007">(Mar 14 2019 at 16:20)</a>:</h4>
<p><span class="user-mention" data-user-id="116009">@nikomatsakis</span> so travis works again, is the GITHUB_TOKEN set up?</p>



<hr><p>Last updated: Aug 07 2021 at 22:04 UTC</p>
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